Many of my clients are woman and come to me ready to die if they do not get the guy. Others have gotten the guy and are going to die if they don’t get RID of him. Hence, I have a front row seat to the subject of obsession. I understand how it feels. I think it is a human experience. As with most life experiences, the chart can guide you from the beginning to the end, with as few casualties as possible. You will come out with valuable lessons, having learned them from the fire, always the best way.
I have never seen obsession without classic aspects in the chart. One is Nessus. Nessus is the asteroid of the abuser and we all have one.The other factor which is always present is the asteroid Dejanira. Dejanira is the asteroid of the victim and we all have one. Astrology is humbling. Each person is capable of everything. However, the chart configuration presents different challenges to each of us. To a person with a prominent Nessus in the natal chart, he will want to abuse. There is no way to say it, but straight out. By prominent, I mean Nessus conjunct the ASC, MC, or any of the personal planets which are the Sun, Moon, Mercury, Venus or Mars. Does he HAVE to abuse? No. Will he abuse until he learns the spiritual and emotional lessons which prevent it? Yes, most likely.
Back to the synastry, Nessus is always dominant in a synastry of obsession. I have my own theory as to why. It is because the relationship brings up childhood abuse. Love and abuse are inextricably bound to the person who was abused as a child. Abuse and love form part of a soup in which the ingredients have melded into one. One cannot distinguish parts. As such, the woman( we shall use a woman here, although it could be a man) feels love when she should be running for the hills.
Dejanira is the asteroid of the victim. In a synastry of obsession, both of these asteroids are prominent. Each person will touch a pivotal part of the chart of the other person with his Nessus and Dejanira. It is simply the case and has never failed. The other thing that always seems to happen is that the relationship heats up to nuclear passion and then dies. When it dies, the passion turns to hatred and the hatred can be bad. It can be cold hatred that plots revenge. One does not toy with these asteroids.
I would not call Nessus and Dejanira soul mate asteroids because a soul mate relationship lasts until people are old and grey. Nessus and Dejanira seems to burn up like a firecracker and when it comes down, it is with a fizzle and a thud. I don’t think there is any high quite like a Nessus/Dejanira relationship.If you have ever been in a relationship which feels like heroin, I would bet it was a Nessus/Dejanira relationship. You will feel like you have found your true soul mate. That seems to be the case in all of these relationships. You are as sure of this as of anything. However, it seems to be a deception based on your own history and not the person in front of you. Nessus and Dejanira relationships seem to be a replay of your history. They are wonderful in the beginning, just as you had glorious promise as a child. However, if you were abused, that promise floated away as debris in the ocean. You were left longing for that old life where endless possibilities still seemed as if they could come true. Nessus and Dejanira relationships allow them to come true for a time. That time is magical like little else but it is a mirage as an oasis in the desert to a man dying of thirst.
You find the nicest photos for your posts… *cough*
If anyone comes to you, obsessed with me, ready to die if they can’t have me… let me know.
Hasn’t happened yet, and I’m not holding my breath. I’m not cool enough for anyone to obsess over me.
You ARE cool enough!!!! You are more than cool enough. Trust me. I am Venus in Gemini 😀
My Moon conjunct Nessus at wide 4 deg orb.
Do you feel an urge to abuse?
Sorry Please ignore, Nessus conjunct Sun and Mercury at 3 deg not 4, but my Dejanira conjunct Saturn at 3 deg. I don’t ever feel like it is right to abuse or wish that upon myself. I believe in the golden rule. But It’s never a nice thing to hurt me. I’d get revenge.
I would have the same question with Nessus conj the Moon as the Sun and mercury, although each would manifest differently. Do you struggle with the desire to abuse people? Also, do you struggle with being victimized over and over?
I don’t struggle to abuse because since I was little, I knew it’s not right and I’ll never wish that to happen to anyone, not even my enemy. I’m a Sag Ascendant,I live my life honorably, the situations that hurt and anger me most are those that show how vicious and stingy people can really be. I’m also a life path 5, the same life path as Pres. Lincoln, who abolished slavery. I am not sure If I’m being victimized over and over. But I have been there where people just want me because of what I can give or so I feel it. That’s why I’m trying to be spiritual, so I know how to listen to myself and trust my instincts that I am making the right decision, choosing the right path and trust the right people.
Have you ever seen iQ’s thread talking about people who were programmed to be ritualist sacrifices…they desire and recall only in subconscious being tortured and abused…possibly even killed for sacrifice to Gods? Its really interesting! Lilith, Nessus, Dejanira, Hekate, Lucifer and Kaali were some major players in that….even Massalina was mentioned!
I have read some of them but it is so upsetting that I did not really spend that much time on it. Who is Massalina?
Hello…I have a very complex situation and I need an advice. There is an artist to whom I composed and sent some music..in general we have pretty complex composite chart and lot of karmic aspects. In fact I discovered today that his Deja conjucts my Venus in Aquarius in his 8 house, exactly at the same degree. I m concerned about our professional tie….who will be the Abuser?
I consider Venus as an artistic planet.
thnx
Well, Friend
I could not tell someone to make a major life decision based on a single comment on my Form. I would have to look at your whole chart and give an opinion and it would only be my opinion. I will say that if his Deja conj your Venus, you will be the abuser more than he imo
thnx.. we met several years ago for the first time and it was 3 minutes short but ultra amazing experience. he remained almost speechless and I had feeling being “finally at home, somewhere beyond this world”. Just like in heaven. I thought he’ s my twin flame… Our composite is really complex – saturn conj sun, mercury and venus conj chiron on ascedent….in 12 house. he must have been my parent in previous life, because my south node conjuct his moon. Unfortunately up to now, we had so many problems with other people around him who were constantly doing harm to me,and to him, lying and manipulating…..That’s 12 composite house I guess. So many things we do in a telepathic way, in dreams and meditation….I took a look in our progressed composite and in october there’ll be moon conjuction to uranus and pluto…I think that’ll be the trigger for our project.
What are the implications of someone’s sun being in conjunction with another person’s Dejanira? If the sun person is not abusive by definition of emotionally or physically abusive, will it still just be perceived by the Dejanira person as abusive, regardless of how the sun person behaves? Are there ways to ease that conjunction?
Great question, Violets
In my opinion, the relationship will play out with the Deja person the victim of the Sun person.Now, we DON”T have Nessus here, which is the abuser asteroid so the Sun does not have to BE the abuser for the Deja to be the victim. Do you see what I mean? The Deja could FEEL like a victim but the Sun may not be an actual abuser to her.
Thank you, Ami. Yes, that makes total sense.
Good, Friend!
Um… Here is the problem. I am the sun placement, and my son is the Deja person. My son also has Cancer AC with Saturn in his 4th house, with a couple of afflictions.
He also has Chiron in exact conjunction with his Deja, which is conjunct my sun by one degree.
I am horrified by our charts, as I love my son and am not an abusive person. I am also not a disciplinarian. But I have no idea what to make of this, and it makes me want to cry to be honest.
My son has a lot of oppositions to his Libra moon with an Aries stellium, so it can be hard for me to keep up with him. I know that I’m not always as “present” as he wants me to be, but that would entail non-stop one-on-one physical activity that can get exhausting after about a half hour. There are also a lot of Pluto/Saturn aspects (or conjunctions), and his Pluto sits on my Vertex, so he is considerably more possessive of me than he is of my husband.
I spend a good amount of time snuggling, playing hard, teaching, kissing, and hugging him.
I’m really at a loss here…
Wow Wow Wow Violets
I see your dilemma.
After we look at your chart on my Forum, we can look at his and your synastry.
I really can see your angst here, Friend. We can take this on as a long term project as it will take time xx
Erm…maybe this wasn’t the best thread to post the above question in (the thought just occurred to me), as it has so much to do with other placements. My apologies. I’m a little muddled right now.
Your post placement is cool, Sweetie. I am an earth void and order is not my thang 😛
This is just nice new discovery!
Can you please tell if a person has a lot of aspects to nessus (in natal chart) and an exacte square to Pluto definitely describes an abuser?Here is also an exact trine to venus.
This person has been sexually abused as a child.
Schould I run away?
Hello Friend and thank you!
Well, I can’t tell you to run away, per se, without seeing the actual charts and the synastry. Then, I could offer an opinion only of what I would do in that situation. You can post the charts on my Forum in the Personal readings section. I will give a general answer though since you took the time to ask the question.
To me, a person with Nessus conjunct a personal planet( Sun, moon, Merc, Mars or Venus),the North Node or the ASC or MC will be an abuser. In rare cases, that person can overcome this. This happens by truly finding God. However, prior to this, they will abuse people. I know many people don’t like me to talk straight but I owe that to my readers. If someone took the time to read and comment, I am not going to respond with politically correct drivel. That is my commitment to the people who read my website.
So, I would not get married to a person with a prominent Nessus. I would not have children with a person with a prominent Nessus.
What is the exact square to Pluto? If it is nessus, it is generational, as Pluto stays in the same place for a long time. Hence, I would not pay much attention to this.
Hello,
My Nessus is 13
I hear you, Marie. I feel the same. 4 degrees is kind of wide for an asteroid. It may be ambient. If so, you can control it. All things can be controlled with God, too xx
My Nessus is 1,5 orb from my moon (Gemini/12th house/Retrograde). Can’t ignore replying to this tread, since here is stated that I would then be an abuser. Sorry but that is less true than anything. I am completely unselfish, so much that I can’t even make myself happy if my happiness doesn’t make someone else happy at the same time… So abuse someone is really the last thing on earth I would ever do. Though, I can say that I am beeing abused myself ‘most’ of the time. That is because other peoples selfishness leads to them finding me good to keep for themselves, since I am so kind and helpful, and wont even hurt a fly. Unfortunately I have a social handicap (communication) that people see only when they get close, and because of it they think that the way to keep me bound to them is by making me think I am worthless to the rest of the world, meaning someone who benefits from me wants to keep me to him/herself by making me believe they are the only one that can stand me – making me feel that wherever I go life can never be better than with that person (eventhough that might be bad too). But that is never true. I have too many other good sides. My social handicap isn’t even that bad. Its really nothing. I see it as minor, but for some reason those people want to see it as enormous (bad circle though, since what other people ‘want’ to see is what you really are). So I always end up beeing abused, going from one abuser to another. So, Moon conjunct Nessus does definitely NOT mean you must be an abuser. Although I can add that I am pretty good at getting back at them when their abuse have stepped over the limit. And Yes, I can be really angry (Mars 0 degrees in cap square pluto). I verbally tell them how selfish their action have been and make them understand their underlying motive (I am good at psychology). That usually ends in them beeing so ashamed of what they put me through, and even more sorry that they lost my love/friendship. They never expected me to be a really strong individual who won’t take crap, only because of how enormous they wanted to see my minor handicap as beeing…
Thank you for replying, Friend.
Just thinking about this, a bit. The Moon is an interior planets, so you may not express the urge to abuse(Nessus) as much as someone with nessus conjunct an exterior point like the ASC or the NN. We all have a Nessus, so you are not unique with that. What does your Dejanira do? Perhaps, you have been more victimized and hence do not identify with the abuser, but more of the victim.
My Dejanira conjunct Mars in Capricorn (Dejanira = 3,2 / Mars = 0,11).
I tried to find what it means when they are conjunct, but no luck.
Nessus is on the other side of the chart in Gemini conjunct Moon (but not in opposition). And Moon conjunct Saturn in 12th house. Pretty much a crappy life of being lonely, isolated, misunderstood and innocently accused. Having lived with that crap all my life I am the Number One to understand that some people can be unlycky enough to end up in the complete wrong situations. I am always trying to help those who are being accused, even though they might also have strong evidence pointing against them – cause they might just be as unlucky as me…
Deja conj Mars would make me think that you would slide into the victim role very easily. You would not realize you were doing it. At work, all of the work could be dumped on you and you would feel as if it were normal, that kind of thing.
Yes, everything is dumped on me. But I realise it. And if I stand up for myself saying its not my job – then they hate me. They spread lies about me and make sure I feel how much they dislike me. And they keep doing that until I either lose my job or I have to quit myself because of the pressure. But for as long as I slave for them, I am ok.
Moon conj Saturn is a very hard one, maybe harder than Moon conjunct Nessus, even. Was your mother very demeaning to you and took away your confidence?
Yes! And she still is, but never admit. Last year I tried to force her to say she is sorry for what she put me through in my childhood. But she just says “I can’t remember”. But she does. I know she does. But besides always and still doing everything she can to undermine my confidence – she is to everyone else the nicest person on earth. And that was also what I used to think about her too, cause in all other ways but the subtile and when no one else is around, she is actually overly nice. She gives me money if I need it etc, making herself an angel. But always, always… she has an urge to make me feel worthless. It really scrues your brain up when someone is overly nice, but psychologically abusive. Because you have no physical evidence to show otherwise.
A few weeks ago I was told by my father that she kept a secret that I was bullied during all years in school. He said when he found out about the bullying and asked her why she never told him – she said she hid it from him so that he wouldn’t be angry(!). If he had a chance to be angry – I would had known he loved me. And I would had known she was my problem rather than those who bullied me in school. And I would had a chance to rise when I was a child. But he never got the chance to stand up for me… He was no support to me at all, cause as it seems my mother always treated him the same way as me. So he has always been living in his own world, feeling unloved and worthless too, thinking he wasn’t worthy my love either. She kept us apart. She had me as a scape goat and my brothers were favourised – but no one believes me when I tell today, except for my father (but no one believes him either because of how scrued up she have made him seem to others). Cause my mother still seems to everyone as being the perfect angelic person, and my communication problem makes everyone think I am the one to blame for everything instead. They see me as evil for wanting to blame my problems on her…
I also have Chiron square Ascendant, being only 1 degree from the beginning of the 11th house cusp. I heard that makes me a healer and more concerned with making other people happy, rather than taking care of myself. My Descendant conjunct North Node. North Node is therefore also square my Chiron (makes people block every step I try taking on my life path, which leaves me to not be able to do much other than spend my time staring into a wall nowadays). As well as Neptune is also only a degree from the 6th house cusp. Heard that as well mean serving others but mostly by being used, both psychologicly and physichly.
I am also always doing my best to give without making others feel the slightest bit guilty if they don’t give anything in return. I give completely without an agenda. There is REALLY NO abuser in me what so ever.
I think your Nessus conj the Moon is overshadowed by other factors such as Moon conj Saturn and Mars conj Deja, even more.
But everything else in my chart seem to go hand in hand. I can’t see why one little asteroid would be placed completely wrong? From your description that asteroid would make me an abuser – but everything else in my chart is saying the opposite and they alls stand together. Don’t you think at all that the asteroids placement next to the moon is only saying that one has been abused – noting else?
EVERYTHING in the chart matters, Friend. God made you and your chart is your blueprint. You can’t throw anything away because you “don’t like it”. That being said, one must balance out things which appear opposite, as yours do. They are not really opposite. They contribute to the whole you. One must just incorporate everything into the final picture.
Oh, I found now that Dejanira square Pluto with only half a degree (Pluto in 4th house, Libra).
But looking to other responses you have on here, can it be that Nessus can be both? I mean both the abuser and the one that really would never even consider abusing? Or simply that it means one was abused in early life? Cause people who have been abuse usually turn out to be extra kind OR they become abusers themselves. I was abused psychologicly as a child… and still by most everyone. Even so, I am still stupid enough to continue being nice to everyone(!).
My Dejanira(9,56 libra) conj Moon( 10,50 libra) conj Pluto( 9,25 libra) conj Child (12,08 libra)
What does it mean?
Wow Ramona. Let me ask you some questions? Were you sexually abused? xx
No, i wasn’t. Is this conj ( 7th house) about beeing abused or a victim?
Please explain what you mean from the beginning, Ramona. I am not following. Thanks!
…my Nessus is exactly conjunct my midheaven in Cancer, but I’m not interested in abusing anyone. Abuse is the opposite of what I want in my life. I try to be very respectful of the humanity of other people, because I know that’s how I would like people to treat me. I think it’s always better to leave behind something positive, even if other people are trying to bring negative. Not saying I’m perfect or anything, I definitely have my weaknesses and vulnerabilities, but that’s part of why I definitely wouldn’t want anyone to abuse me or vice versa. So why is it on my midheaven?
My Dejanira is conjunct mean BML in the 12th, a few degrees away from true BML pluto ascendant (libra), if that’s relevant.
Thanks for sharing, Antipodes. What is your Moon sign? I bet it is a tender one like Cancer or maybe Taurus.
it’s in libra. i guess that’s pretty tender :-/
Tell me your placements–ASC, Sun, venus, Mars etc, if you care to.
Well, Libra Moon is not a tender Moon. It is called the Courtesan’s Moon because it can separate it’s emotions from it’s reason. IOW, it can be cold and make cold plans lol.
I’m a woman, and I am sort of infatuated with a man who has his North Node in 5 deg Sagittarius, conjunct my Dejanira in 5 deg Sagittarius. My father was emotionally abusive and I never felt safe around him; this man gives a similar vibe; I know deep down that this attraction is creepy and unhealthy, but it’s so hard to resist.
it’s weird because my Dejanira is not exactly prominent..or maybe it is? Depends on the orbs allowed for aspects, I guess. It’s square my Mercury and North Node in 3 and 4 degrees Pisces, respectively, and opposite my Moon in 29 Taurus, and opposite my Mars and Jupiter, both of which are in 0 Gemini.
I think I’ve had a victim mentality most of my life, so I guess these aspects must be strong enough?
I also have Nessus in 22 Virgo, conjunct Asc in 18 Virgo, opposite Sun in 22 Pisces, and Venus in 16 Pisces. I never get the urge to abuse, maybe because I’ve felt hurt a lot, growing up, but I am very, very vengeful. I can wait years to strike back at someone for an old suffering.
Funny enough, my arch enemy in high school, a girl I had constant “battles” with and who did me a lot of harm was also a Pisces Sun in 20 or 21 degrees. Don’t know her asteroid positions, though.
Welcome Mandy!
Thank you for being so honest. That is one part of my website I really value, that people can be honest. When a person has a dark, creepy attraction, they cannot help it. feelings are what they are. If Your deja conjuncts his SN exact, you will bring victim hood to the relationship and probably BE the victim.
With Nessus conj the ASC, you will want to abuse. You can’t help that either. You can come and put your whole chart up in my Forum if you want to ask more questions, my Friend!
Well I have Nessus practically cj Mars and Saturn (and Betelgeuse) in Gemini in the 10th. Moon and Venus conjunct Dejanira in Pisces in 6th and square MC/Rigel. So both are pretty *weighted* in my chart. I have gone through periods of having PTSD from various occurrences in my life but when I watch how other people deal wih similar problems, I refuse to trade on my weakness and become a victim, I gather together all my strength and I say there is nothing that cannot be overcome, I prefer to take the road of an empowered Uebermensch, if that makes any sense.
I also have Sun and Merc in the 8th in Aries, opposite Uranus in Libra, and also have Pluto in the 1st. An astrologer who saw my chart was somehow astonished by it. (??? )
Welcome Kassia!
How close are the Nessus and Deja conjunctions?
Within about 3 dg., which I reckon is close enough. Also what I found interesting was that my mother’s Nessus was within 3 dg. of my Sun, my father’s close by but not so close. I had a lot of problems with abuse from my mother for years, where she successfully got my father involved, although we both cottoned on to what was happening and left her. I am having counselling for alcohol problems and through this and through creativity I am doing the wotk on myself and resolving not to be the victim. It is interesting that my mother cannot cope with beings born around (my birthdate). She bought a highly intelligent breed of dog a couple of years back which she was warned was unsuited to her as she is too fond of control, this dog later turned on her as I have, many a time. In fact her Nessus would have been bang on the dog’s Sun, she had to give it away as she could not cope.
My mother is reaching the end of her life now and is still very negative but I steel myself against her negativity and strive towards my own positive thoughts and actions. It’s worth remembering that whatever controllers try to do in their lives, people will always desert them in the end, either through jumping ship or fighting back. If you just sit there and take it you’re done for.
Wow Kassia
Thanks for sharing that. Nessus conj the Sun will play out except if God overcomes it, which He can and only Him, in my opinion.
Hi Ami,
My future husband sun conjuncts my dejanira by 2.30 degrees. Will he abuse me? Thank you.
Gwyn
I don’t like it. I can’t predict, legally or even morally, perhaps, but I would not want it. my Friend.
Thank you. We are getting married in less than three weeks.
Wow If I were in your position, I would have an astrologer do the chart before the marriage and I would heed it because the charts will play out.
I did met up with a psychic/astrologer personally where I am living, she is the mother of my friend’s friend and she gave me a nice discount. She didn’t say anything about the dejanira and sun conjunctions. But she told me that the relationship can be a long term relationship but there is someone much more suitable that will come to my life. Although she did told me too, that if there is no guy on the horizon, then my current boyfriend(fiancee now) can be suitable for me.
I can’t say more, Gwyn dear. I wish you will in whatever path you choose.
Tell me the story of the relationship, Gwen. Is it an arranged marriage?
No, we met online. He is nice to me and treats me right. I just found out now about the synastry between the sun and dejanira, though.
Well, if it were me, I would not marry someone with that position, I don’t think. If I married him, I would expect the Deja to play out, too.
Will it be about sexual abuse? because I read also that dejanira is sexual abuse…
It depends on the rest of the chart. There are many factors to come up with a conclusion like that or an opinion because it is an opinion. It takes me 5-6 days to do a synastry so I could not give a quick opinion, here, Gwyn dear.
Thank you for your time, Ami.
You are welcome, Gwyn.
Well um…forewarned is forearmed, but to be honest I’d worry about problems if and when they come up in your marriage and tackle them then. I don’t know why, but a lot of problems seem to arise from fear, or from sharing the abuse one has suffered? And if we fear things we can end up acting the stuff out we fear.
I’d take a really good look inside yourself and ask yourself how you genuinely *feel* about this guy. Yes past events can be confirmed by astrology but what is motivating you to consult astrology, do you have reservations? How the person genuinely makes you feel is most important, ie are they patient, impatient, trustworthy or have they something insincere about them that you can’t put your finger on, are they too nice for their own good? Also , what of the situation in which your relationship plays out?? Do you have a feeling of having experienced this same type of person before??
Etc., etc.
Good day Ami.
This man’s Nessus conjunct my Pluto by 1 degree, Saturn at 2 degrees and square my MC by 2 degree also his Dejanira conjunct my Chiron at 3 degrees.
And as for me, my Nessus opposition his Chiron at 4 degree, does that mean we will abuse each other physically or emotionally?
His south node conjunct my sun at 1 degree and my moon square his north node at 1 degree. Do you think there is karmic link between us?
Thank you for your kind reply 🙂
Hi Scarlet!
I don’t believe in karma, in terms of past lives, as I am a Bible believer and we believe once born and once to die. However, I would think this would be an abusive relationship and I don’t think it would last, either. I see it as short term. That is my opinion, anyway, my Friend. Please, tell me the story.
Dear Ami,I have an off-on relationship with a guy I met online.We have a big age difference.In our synastry,his Nessus (conj.with his Mars natally)is conjunct my Venus by 1deg and my Dejaneera is conj.with his NN (which is also my NN,just 4deg away).What’s more his eros is 5deg away from conjuncting my Psyche.No abuse yet,just long hurt silence when we fight and a burning longing to be together again when we part.Any comments from your enlightening mind?Thank you!
Welcome, F! Well, with asteroids, the orb is small. I go up to 3 degrees in a conjunction but that is far. The Deja/venus is powerful. I would have to see the whole chart and you can put it on my Forum and I will be delighted to look, my Friend. Have you met him yet?