I am my own laboratory. My relationships are my lab rats( said with affection). If you see yourself in this article, know that Chiron relationships just seem to blow up. Neither person is the good guy. Neither person is the bad guy. I think I found some insights on why they blow. Look at all your relationships which get close very quickly and have a very deep intimacy. If there is a strong Chiron in synastry, most likely, they will not last.
First of all, let me define a Chiron relationship. One person’s Chiron must conjunct a PERSONAL planet or angle in the other person’s charts. Chiron may conjunct asteroids, too.In these cases, it would be the bad asteroids. By bad, I mean asteroids like Sedna( severe betrayal by men), Medusa( destruction by women), Dejanira( the victim) and Nessus( the abuser) I use the conjunction because it is the strongest aspect. In my research, I do not look at other aspects with Chiron. It is not because they do not count, just that the conjunction trumps all other aspects in intensity.
So, the Chiron relationship could be all manner of aspects. It could be Sun/Chiron, Moon/Chiron, Mercury/Chiron/ Mars/Chiron, Saturn/Chiron,Venus/Chiron, Ascendent/Chiron. MC/Chiron, IC/Chiron, DSC/Chiron or various asteroids conjunct Chiron. The conjunction must be close. It must be 2-3 degrees, tops, in my experience.
Now that we have defined a Chiron relationship, let me share about some of mine, how they started, progressed and failed. One of my most recent ones was with a woman. It got close fast. It felt the way best friends feel, warm and safe. It started going bad when I had a very different philosophy on life. She did not agree. I stood firm. It got tense. She acted poorly to me. I stood up. However, in this case, we had an unusual outcome in that we were able to make a peace, not a friendship, but a peace. Once Chiron relationships break, they never go back to what they were. That is another defining trait.
However, when I looked more closely, I saw that she was reacting from pain of a mother whom she saw as rigid in the same belief system I had. *I* was reacting from not being allowed to have a voice as a child. She was saying”Don’t be rigid like my mother”. I was saying, “I WILL have my voice and you are not going to stop me” Hence, the core pain of each person played out. This is another trait of the Chiron relationship i.e the core pain will play out. Again, no one is the good one and no one is the bad one.
I will describe another recent Chiron relationship. This was Saturn/Chiron. I was the Saturn. This relationship got close very quickly. I felt as if we would be best friends forever. He did, too. I helped him when he was in a lot of pain. He came to some profound spiritual insights. It was very exhausting for me as I gave a great deal of my primal energy. However, I was very happy.
The problem arose when he said that maybe he did NOT believe what he had accepted. I said that was fine but I did not want to hear about it. He said that he could say what he wanted. I said that I had a boundary and did not want to discuss this ONE point. He said that he did not want to talk to me anymore.
Again, no one is right and no one is wrong. It is a situation where pain comes out and controls the outcome. His pain was that he could not say what he wanted. My pain was that I had a mother who I kept trying to show various truths.. She would seem to see it and then after all my efforts would act like she saw nothing.
Please, don’t get lost in the details of this, look at the larger point of pain intersecting. I give the details, just to make it clearer about how pain intersects.
If I go back to my Venus/Chiron relationship that failed, I have some new insights. I was the Venus. She was the Chiron. I am not sure who comes to whom for healing, the planet person or the Chiron person. The planet person may be the one who learns the lessons more. At any rate, in this relationship, we got close fast. We felt like we were best friends. We shared all sorts of intimate details, some we never shared with others. I thought she dissed me but in retrospect, she didn’t. She needed space. She thought I violated her space but I did not.
She has Chiron in the 12th. She has hidden pain. I was bringing up her hidden pain. I don’t think she knew what exactly was happening. The person with Chiron in the 12th cannot put his finger on his pain as can the people with Chiron in the other houses. Hence, I brought out something in her and she exploded. The funny thing was that the incident was very, very small. This is classic for Chiron blow ups, too.
I hope you have learned something of value from this article. Please, share your experiences, Friends!
Ronnie Valentine, a wonderful Astrologer said these kind words to me. I put them up here with gratitude and humility( and because I need a little TLC 😀 )
Chiron brings madness to earth in a tantalizing way. I like how you translate it to relationships…You carry on tantalizing us all!
Hi Ami,
If his Chiron conjuncts my Dejanira exactly and my Chiron conjuncts his Ceres exactly, what kind of pain are we likely to bring each other?
OUCH I cannot see it lasting with those aspects, based on my experience with charts. That is my opinion and not written in stone, of course.
I tried to get Mr. Valentine’s “special message” that you told me about a few days ago.
Do you have to be regestered on Facebook to get it?
I tried Googling Mr. Valentine on Quick Links. I wrote, “Ronnie Valentine, Astrologer.”
I came up with many “Ronnie Valentine’s, but not the real one.
By the way, I found your Facebook site. Are you that very attractive woman with the
waist high boots? Do you reside in Utah? That must be very pretty country.
The boots? No, I have boots sitting down on the chair with my dog but not waist high lol Ronnie Valentine is in one of my Astrology groups on FB. He just posted on here, today. You can see his comment under one of my articles. I would be honored if he would join the Forum. Then, you could talk to him, more.
I put Ronnie’s message on the bottom of my article, I think. I am not sure where I put it now lol
With one man,
His Chiron conjunct my Valentine/ my Pholus
his Chiron is Pisces 14 degrees, and my Valentine is Pisces 16/ my pholus pisces 14 deg. (exactly conj)
My Chiron conj. his Admetos
My Chiron conj. his Sedna (he has admetos conj sedna)
What happened with this guy, Shen?
Everything fast, from knewing each other till stop. Fasttt (Suppose his name Charles)
Moreover, relate on bad asteroids:
My sedna conj his fortuna (1 deg.)
My medusa conj his apollo (1 deg)
my medusa conj his juno (3 deg)
My dejan conj his IC (2 degree)
and
His medusa conj my pallas (1 deg.)
his dejan conj my pallas (2 degree)
(note: my sun/moon mp exactly conj my pallas as well)
His nessus conj my Jupiter (orb 3)
Pls clarify this. so curious to know. who plays a big role in this synastry? Who Control? and which one is victim?
Thank you a lot for your devoted
<>
WOW
The most powerful ones would be on PERSONAL points on your chart such as ASC, IC etc and personal planets. You have your deja conj his IC. You may abuse him. His Nessus con your Jupiter. He may abuse you. This would be a Nessus/Deja relationship imo
Ok– both are victims and both are abusers. You are kind of equal here. Now, tell me about the relationship from start to finish, if you can!
My mom’s friend introduced me and Charles to know each other. I “like at the first sight”(not yet love) him (I guess he like me, too). His face is very familiar to me even we never met before, and I like his looking, his personality. Overall, I feel familiar him with no reasons.
And I feel I’m open when talking (communication) with him. Generally, I’m quiet person when I first know a new person and still not close with them. But in case of Charles, it’s different.
Then, he phoned me. We talked, but not everyday. We met only 2 times (include the first time we met). … Time passed, just about a few weeks, very short, huh
Bang! one day, I faced some incident. I told him. He was not happy to hear that. He felt not good about it(an issue). After that, he’s gone. He didn’t call me again!!
So, that was the end of it, Shen?
In synastry, Uranus/ Moon/ Mercury play a big role. I think. Oh, I forgot Saturn as well.
My sat conj his sun. my moon square his sat (it’s also trine his moon). His moon is in my 1st house and my moon is in his 10th house. His moon oppose my Asc. My sun/moon mp oppose his moon.
His venus square my Uranus. My Dsc sextile his Uranus. His Vertex conj my Uranus. My Vertex conj his mercury. his mercury square my north node. My mercury conj his mars. His Asc conj my sun/moon mp (3 deg. Orb). ,…..
His mars conj my 10th house cusp.
One more thing, Lilith show itself here in synastry as well. But in real life, we never even touch hand.
When I’m interested in astrology and study it. In my opinion, I think that me and him has many relevant in synastry. Just a few weeks, may not enough to learn each other. Probably it should be a longer time.
Not know, venus square Uranus will end their task? It may effect again in “Love Return”? or up & down, or on – off relationship. I don’t know. I just guess if it happen. And from these astro details, Do u think it could happen?
I really, really need to see the charts to say, Shen dear. It is not fair to you to make a guess without the visual of the charts. I have a Forum and you can post your charts.
Yeap
Gone with the wind
Aww I am sorry, Shen. Chiron relationships seem to follow that course, my dear Friend.
(Addition: My eros exactly conj his venus and conj his hekate. my Aphrodite conj his echo. my amor conj his alde.
My anteros conj his cupido and his vesta.
my asc conj His gal. (3 orb)
his asc conj my orcus 2 deg. )
What is anteros, Shen? His Hekate conj your eros may make him have a hard time with erotic things with you. Does he?
From checking its meaning, it’s “Love Return”, love revenge. (I wish the first meaning!)
In real life, we never touch so I can’t say it out. (anyway, he’s older than me 10 years+
I never heard Veus/Uranus be a love return. That would be the Venus Retrograde. That can bring old loves back.
If his Galactic center conj your ASC, there will be a super attraction. You will both feel it and it will feel like you fell off the side of the earth. Is that how it felt? This is some powerful, powerful synastry all around, Shen. I am excited to hear the whole story, if you can.
Yes, we are. : )
; )
stunning
my Gal. conj his gal. as well. Significant?
Anyway, my Asc conj Gal. (2 degree Orb)
Pls advice
I will come back and study your posts, Shen dear.
This would be a super powerful attraction, Shen.
and if, in natal chart, my Asc conj Gal. (2 degree Orb).
that means I’m super powerful attract to others people?
Yes, you would have super charisma. Now, you have to send me a pic, Shen.
mo******@my****************.com
Ami,
What about the ‘healing’ part of chiron? Most others articles i have read lean toward chiron grappling with own pain but being able to heal similar pain of others when contacted in synastry.
Pardon me for saying this, but in another article you said you have a ‘victim mentality’ sometimes. Could it be why you have overlooked the healing side and focused only on the pain side of Chiron?
You can ask me anything, Marion! Know that. I think there IS healing but the relationship may not last. You will learn and you will heal but the relationship may not be able to go the distance. I don’t think it will, in my opinion and my experience, Marion.
Am I right about you’re residing in Utah? It’s good if you are! That will probably be one
of the last places to fall.
I had thought you lived in or near Virginia, because you attended collage there.
I lived one year of my life on the outskirts of Lynchburg Va. That was in 1969.
Jerry Fawell was not nationally known at the time. I was only 11 and as fat as a house.
But I did good in school because none of the other kids even bothered to do their homework.
I could have gotten straight A’s, but I was under constant pressure from bullies so it
affected my grades.
It was a case of “The Road Not Travelled.”
I don’t say where I live. I get hate mail and I don’t want danger coming to my family( or me :D) Aww, so sad about bullies. Are you sure your time of birth is right. In what house is your Chiron? You feel like you have a first house Chiron to me and conj the ASC.
I don’t say where I live. I get hate mail and I don’t want danger coming to my family( or me :D) Aww, so sad about bullies. Are you sure your time of birth is right. In what house is your Chiron? You feel like you have a first house Chiron to me and conj the ASC.
Can’t forget more about Chiron,
His Chiron inconjunct my mars, venus, Saturn. And square my Neptune.
My Chiron: conj his admetos, square his venus. And my Chiron inconjunct his juno, his ceres, his mars.
My valentine and my pholus conj his Chiron.
My Chiron conj his sedna (2 deg.), and conj his fortuna (3 deg.)
Does these bring “pain” to both of us?
I really need to see the charts when I get long lists of things. I don’t like to give fast answers because the questions are very important. I can’t really tell from this list what Chiron does, exactly. Shen dear.
I guess you see so many charts daily, that you must have forgotten that you DID do
mine once. I have Chiron in the 7th house, which explains among other things, why I
am fated to die alone!
Yes, I remember that you had Chiron in the 7th. That is a hard one, for sure, Lon dear.
The moment you understand the pattern of the lesson, you can overcome it and let go from Chiron negative energies, Chrion is also very powerful once we get past that painful wound, and convert it to an amazing experience.
I have not seen it long term but I hope I do with you, Moonie dear!
Could you tell me what an absence of planets in the first house means?
Suppose a person has nothing in their first house, and also has NOTHING in their
12 and 2nd houses? How would the world view such a person? How would the person
view themselves? Would it be mass confusion?
Nothing in the 12th is good. The 12th is the House if Undoing. It is very hard. The hardest part of any chart is 12th House planets. No one wants them, really, if they are being honest, but one has to deal with them, of course.