There is attraction based on dark forces like rage, pain and abuse. Does the man walk up to you and tell you that he wants to abuse you because you seem like the perfect victim? Hardly. In fact, it is the opposite. It seems like the man of your childhood dreams walked out of the ether into your life like the larger than life heroes on the movie screens. It always starts this way. If it feels too, too good to be true, it often is.
In these dark, sexual relationships, you feel the raw passion and soul mate connection like no other. You never want to leave your beloved’s side until they put you in the grave. However, there is a flip side. The flip side is that when it ends( and it usually does) you could go to jail for homicide.
When these relationships end, it is not pretty. It is not pretty at all. That is why I, affectionately, call them “too hot not to cool down.” There are certain aspects I see in these dark,nuclear passion relationships. You say that you want a nuclear passionate relationship. Everyone should have one once in a lifetime, I suppose. It is like sky diving. You can say you did it and you can help the next person who comes along.
1. Moon/Pluto does not have to be dark sexual but if any planetary aspect would be, it would be this. Moon conjunct Pluto is the strongest of the Moon/Pluto aspects because the conjunction trumps any other aspect in strength. Think sitting next to a roaring fire. In the conjunction, the planets are next to each other( or on top of each other in the exact conjunction).
Moon/Pluto as a conjunction is not dark , per se. It is very, very powerful. When/if that turns bad, it could become dark. However, Moon/Pluto in conjunction does not have to turn bad. It is a true soul mate aspect, to me. It is the passion of lovers and the pure, primal love of a mother for her baby. Powerful, you say? YES
Moon/Pluto in a trine is very powerful, too. It is not as intense as the conjunction but very intense, nonetheless. This is not a dark aspect, either.
Moon oppose Pluto and Moon square Pluto could tend to be dark because they are powerful and not with a harmonious flow. We are dealing with very primal emotions here and we all know what primal emotions and passions can do if a person is not careful. If you see Moon oppose or square Pluto, don’t play with the person. If you want to end it, be upfront and be kind. Playing with someone’s emotions when these aspects are involved could lead to bad things such as violence.
2. Mars/Pluto
Mars/Pluto is more primal in a pure sexual way than Moon/Pluto which is more emotional and much more emotionally bonded. You can have Mars/Pluto with a fling and not feel a thing in your emotions.We have the same kind of weighting with the conjunction, trine, opposition and square as we did above.
To summarize, I would say that Mars/Pluto could be passionate sex and passionate emotions but no soul.If a chart had no Moon aspects and Mars/Pluto aspects, I would say it would be a fling.
3. Now, we come to things that could really make the relationship dark. The first would be Nessus
Nessus is the abuser’s asteroid. I, always, have people want to tell me that Nessus is not always abuse. To me, it always is. The exception would be the person who overcame it through God. However, this person would have to play it out before he overcame it. If you see Nessus in synastry, make sure you know which side of the fence he is on. To be honest, few people overcome Nessus. It can be done but it is rare that someone reaches that level of spiritual mastery. I have seen it in a few people, only.
4. Another asteroid that is dark is Dejanira. Dejanira is the victim asteroid. People tell me the same thing they tell me with Nessus. “Not all people with a prominent Dejanira are victims” I disagree.I think they will be until they can truly overcome it with God. Many people say they have overcome things but I watch their actions and see they are lying. They are deceiving themselves, would be a better way to say it. The chart allows one to see oneself. That is why it is so powerful. That is why I don’t mince words. It is disrespect to Astrology which I love and respect.
To put it plainly, if you have a dominant Nessus, you will be an abuser. If you have a dominant Dejanira, you will be a victim. If you do not have either of these in the natal but have them in synastry, it will play out the same way. In other words, if a man’s Nessus conjuncts your ASC, he will abuse you, in my opinion. If a man’s Nessus conjuncts, your Sun, Moon, Venus, Mars or North Node, he will abuse you, in my opinion. If your Dejanira conjuncts his ASC, Sun, Moon, Mercury, Mars, Venus or NN, you will be his victim.
Before I leave this subject, I will add my theory. This is based on experience and charts, as are all my theories. I think the Nessus/Deja relationship in synastry is a re-play of childhood abuse. That is why it is so powerful. That is why it feels so life and death. It brings you back to the time when you were a child and truly powerless.
5. Uranus/Mars in synastry can be kinky. This is not dark sexual, per se. However, if you have Nessus/Dejanira and Mars/Uranus, particularly in hard aspect( opposition and square), it may make for dark spice, shall we say. the reason this is the case is that Mars is sexual drive( all drives actually). Uranus is kink, so you do the math.
I am looking to add 5 more aspects and would love your opinions!
Hi! I was thinking that maybe one of the “lesser” factors could be moon/mars contacts? Obviously the hard ones, like by a square or an opposition, adding to the (possibly) destructive passion! Maybe also Mars/Uranus?
I’ve only been studying astrology casually for 5 years, so even though I know the basic interpretation of those planets in contact, I’d still love to hear it from a pro 🙂 love your blog!
Thank you Ivs. I am honored to have you as a valued member of my website family 😀
Good thought about Moon/Mars, Ivs.
Ivs, why don’t you come put your chart in my Personal Readings Forum. You have such a sweet spirit. I sense Saggi. Am I right? 🙂
Not a sag actually, but a virgo with tons of leo in her chart, lol. And posting my charf sounds like fun, I just might 😀
I thought you were a guy lol
Lol just noticed what you wrote at the end about Mars/Uranus, sorry!
What about Lilith-Venus?
Lilith is not dark, per se, Friend. She is raw sexuality which will not be dark if it touches Venus imo and Welcome 😀
what if I have my Lilith conjunct his juno and his venus. His Pluto sextile my moon, His Jupiter conjunct my moon and his Neptune conjunct my moon, also his mars opposite my venus, is that conducive to passion and helping me release my cancer 8th house sun conjunct north node repressesion? 🙂
Why don’t you come and put the chart up on my Forum? Have you tried? Just from reading this, I think it looks very good but I really need to see the wheel as it is easier.
hmm well I don’t really have his birth time 🙁 lol so I just went by the general aspects, so I can see what he does to my moon and where his planets fall in my houses but not vice versa.
We can still find a lot of info with no time of birth. You lose about 25% but still have about 75%. Come and post the charts. Set his time to 12 midnight but TELL me, so I know before I look! xx
haha you are so cute, I like you and you write very simple and easy to understand. so, quick question, where do I post it? under what theme of the forum? and should I post the picture of the chart (I usually get it from astro.com)? I guess i’ll post mine and then our synastry chart. thank you again for being so welcoming
Thank you so much, Sovietlana! Your words mean a lot to me! Please post the charts
his moon is in cancer so depending on what time he’s born, there are 2 scenarios :1) my Saturn squares his moon but my sun and north node would conjunct it 2) my Pluto would square his moon but our moons would be in trine. Not sure which one i’d prefer….
Hmm
I would have to consider the scenarios more. Try to post the charts so see a visual!
What about nessus exactly conjunct BML in synastry the man is nessus (9h)
Wow Is there a super attraction that feels so strong that it will blow you off your feet? lol
I appreciate your thoughts on these aspects but I am concerned when any astrologer singles out specific aspects and makes sweeping judgements about charts and how the energies in that chart will be made manifest. Planets and asteroids will be modified when they aspect each other, this the possibilities are endless. I have some extreme aspects and I shudder to think how they would be expressed had I not had saturn at the top of my chart who keeps things in check via a grand trine involving some big bad planets. Further, there is such a thing such as free will.
Nonetheless, your interpretation of dejanira and nessus is intriguing.
Thank you, Phoenix
I hear your concern. In order to talk about an asteroid, one must isolate it. Also, I try to be very direct to counter the tendency in many Astrologer not to take a stand. I do Astrology the way that I would want to learn it. For that reason, I am not for everyone and know this but I seem to be appreciated by people who think like I do. Thank you for your comment. Please, keep giving your opinion. It is valued!
My first husband was abusive – His Nessus conjunct my Descendant
with Dejanira conjunct his natal Sun
A later relationship was abusive (a psychopath) – His Nessus square my Sun
with Dejanira conjunct his natal Saturn, Mars. My Nessus square his Venus
Dejanira trines my Ascendant
Wow, Fly
Thank you for weighing in!
Hi,
Excellent blog.
Do these asteroids have to be conjunct planets or square each other to be dangerous? What about Nessus conjunct Dejanira in synastry and there is no abuse whatsoever, what would that mean?
L
I believe her Dejanira is conjunct his Nessus by one degree.
In my opinion, it will play out. If it has not of yet, it may be a new relationship.
Thank you, Lo and Welcome 😀
Yes, these asteroids have to be in a very close conjunction with other planets ( or a very close square) to be dangerous. If one does not see any abuse when this happens, my opinion would be that they don’t know the person enough lol
I know it is not funny but the charts will play out, in my experience, anyway.
Please, tell me about the situation, Lo.
Hi Amiann,
That’s why it’s so weird bc it is a very good longterm relationship. There are no planets conjunct or square either Nessue or Dejanira in either chart, the only conjunction is her Dejanira to his Nessus. I think there’s a trine or sextile to other asteroids but nothing major.
I came across your blog post and so went through my charts looking for couple friends and this one came up as having the conjunction. It’s not a square but there isn’t much info out there on the conjunction. Also, there is no abuse either way. They’re both devoted and kind people and I’ve known her since we were teens. They’re still deeply in love and their synastry and composite charts support it.
Is there a positive aspect to this connection?
What does Nessus and Dejanira mean when conjuncting each other?
Are they married, Lo. Things don’t come out until marriage, sometimes. Is there a good part to Nessus/deja conjunct? I would say no, but I am not the last word in anything. There is precious little practical info out there on asteroids. I seem to be one of the rare people doing it lol
They are married.
They have lots of soulmate connections in the charts and both make really strong NN conjunctions and squares in synastry. I think her NN is right on his 7th house axis for one. His makes two major squares to her inner planets. Lots of good aspects so that’s why the Nessus Dejanira confuses me. I was shocked to see it in this couple’s charts.
Could it be a past life meaning? Her NN on his 7th makes me think it’s a past life hold.
I don’t believe in past lives, Lo. Maybe, the good aspects just out weight this one. That would be my guess.
Thanks for your help Amiann. Let’s hope more info comes out about this connection.:)
Well, I have been thinking about the situation. I would say that there must be wonderful soul connections that keep down the abuse that would come up without these. DO they have Moon trine Moon or Moon conjunct Moon. They have transcended Nessus conj Dejanira, which is a new situation for me to see. Do you have their synastry you could post on my Forum?
Hi Amiann,
Sorry for the late reply. I asked if I could post their charts but my friend isn’t comfortable with it.
But I did find out that her Amor conjuncts their Dejanira-Nessus conjunction, so her Dejanira is conjunct her Amor. His Amor is in trine and sextile to a few of her inner planets. Yes, their Moons are trine – both in Earth signs.
One other thing that might be helpful with this asteroid pairing, and one that I think is quite meaningful…. They have a very imaginative sex life. Their chemistry is obvious even after all these years but she did recently reveal that some light BDSM play is involved. That might be how they’re playing out their Nessus-Dejanira, though I’m not sure since they also have a lot of mutual Uranus and Pluto contacts to inner planets and both Ascendants.
Eros is also prominent in their synastry. His Eros is on her Descendant and her Eros makes a square to his Sun and conjuncts his Vertex. Eros isn’t making any connections to either Dejanira or Nessus though.
Very lovely Eros synastry, too.
the Moons will make for best friends. Lovely, Lo!
Your articles hit me hard again:-). I wouldn’t think my mars/Pluto semisextile is as strong though it can do damage
hmmm
crap. My Dejanira is in 5 Sag, like his North Node.
His Dejanira is in 25 Scorpio, conjunct my Part of Fortune in 27 Scorpio, opposite my Moon in 29 Taurus and Mars and Jupiter, in 0 Gemini. Does this mean anything?
I never heard of these asteroids, especially being linked to abusers and victims. Where did you get these theories from?
Also, It doesn’t suit me. I also have Nessus in 22 Virgo exactly opposite my Sun, conjunct my Asc in 18 Virgo, and I am NOT an abuser, unless it’s in self defense.Either way, I don’t enjoy hurting people.
With asteroids, I would accept a 3 degree conjunction, tops. IF the chart does not seem right, then I think the time of birth is off. It may be off a few minutes and change things. However, if the time is right, for sure, I would trust the chart over a personal account. I have to always be honest. That is my commitment to my readers.
Still, even without the conjunction, I have Nessus in the 1st house, which would make me abusive, according to these theories, and I don’t fit.
If anything, I’ve suffered abuse from others at times. I do find it funny that I have Dejenira in 5 deg Sag, since most of my arch enemies were Sags. I generally cannot stand them, and their tendency to be arogant and conceited towards anyone who doesn’t think the way they do does come across as downright abusive to me.
I’m curious about that conjunction to my crush’s NN, though..do you really think it could mean something? It is just the North Node, after all, not a personal planet.
His Nessus makes no major aspect to my planets, except a 3 orb trine to my Mercury and North Node, and Vertex..could this mean we’ll step on each other’s toes when it comes to reaching our goals?
YES, your Deja conj his NN will make you his victim, to put it really directly. This is my opinion and other people may differ but I call things as I see them, Mandy dear.
PS I checked the synastry of a man I know for sure was abused by his own father physically and emotionally, throughout his childhood, and this man’s Nessus is conjunct his father’s Sun. So the theory doesn’t check out.
Lets see. The Nessus is usually the abuser but in this case, it was the son. I bet that the son was still the abuser though, even if he was the victim, as a child. We need to look at the whole chart to see the whole story. I don’t think you can draw the concrete conclusion you did from these aspects. When the son grows up, he will likely be the abuser,too. Do you see what I mean. The chart is complex and one has to look at the entire chart to draw very global conclusions. For teaching purposes, one must break things down, so it may seem like it is contrary but it is really not, imo, Sandy.
Well, maybe, but don’t most abusers have a history of childhood abuse themselves? That can be justified through basic psychology, I think. Children create their future adult personalities by learning from the adults around them and their interactions, so it makes sense, sadly.
I think there are very few people who actually manage to overcome childhood abuse, and not without a long painful journey and negative experiences.
Yes, this is all very true but the charts exist outside of time, too. I mean, a person’s life is complicated. That being said, the charts WILL play out, imo and ime.
Yes, this is all very true but the charts exist outside of time, too. I mean, a person’s life is complicated. That being said, the charts WILL play out, imo and ime.
Hi Amiann, how do you think nessus square neptune would play out in synastry, let’s say if it’s almost exact. I am the nessus person and I admit to having some devious tendencies towards anyone with neptune in that position.
Hi Fluffy and Welcome!
Well you may want to take advantage of their trust and innocence. They may not be able to see what you are up to and you could use this for your gain. Does that fit and I applaud your willingness to face yourself.
Thank you. 🙂
Yeah, the “They may not be able to see what you are up and you could use this for your gain” fits perfectly. Always leaving them in a fog of confusion, along with lies, victim playing and guilt trips. I always seem to have the opinion that these people are somewhat evil yet gullible and innocent and therefore they deserve to be abused.
And when you really think about it this line of thought “deserve to be abused” is quite sociopathic in nature. And as far as I know there’s a strong correlation between nessus and psychopaths/abusers.
Astrology never fails to amaze me…
Aww Fluffy
The charts tell all. That never ceases to amaze me, either!
Good afternoon, thank you for this article
Would you say that a double whammy Nessus OPPOSITE Juno is something dangerous too ? or is the bad guy Nessus only dangerous when in conjonction with Dejanira ?
woman ‘s Dejanira and Juno, ( 4°45 and 4°32 Scorp ) both conjunct man’s Eros and Chiron, (5°10 Scorp, 5°30 Scorp ) and both OPPOSITE man’s Nessus (6° Taurus)
and DW : woman’s Nessus (13° Gemini) opposite man’s Juno ( 12° Sag)
Hi Eva!
Great questions. Asteroids touching asteroids are not as powerful as asteroids touching persona; points on the chart such as the ASC, Moon, Sun, Venus etc. I could not really answer this question without seeing the whole chart. You could post it in my Forum if you would like, Eva. Did you know I had one?
His 8th house Nessus is conjunct my 7th house Dejanira (2s), opposite my moon (-1s) and square my mercury (2a). My Dejanira is square his venus (-0a) and conjunct his vertex (0s).
We`ve known each other for a few months and generally it is a good relationship. We have our arguments and I sometimes feel put down by him (and, to be fair, he feels the same way about me) and sometimes my self-esteem suffers. There`s also lot of growth and sweetness and nothing that amounts to abuse.
Could you specify what you mean by abuse (subtle, verbal, violent etc.?)? And how did you arrive at the conclusion that Nessus and Dejanira are indicative of abuse? Is this something that reliably and consistently is reflected in a variety of different charts?
Welcome, Ariel and great questions. With asteroids, one must be an intrepid explorer because there is precious little PRACTICAL info out there. What use is reams of esoteric info for real life applications. I seemed to be destined to study and use Nessus and Deja. In my studies and usage of them, they play out to be the abuser and the victim. They play out to have a certain pattern to the relationship. The relationship seems to end in a certain way, too. I have no vested interest in any asteroid or any placement being any way other than my being able to help people. As such, Nessus seems out to be the abuser and Deja the victim. I have not seen it fail in all of my chart work. I am one person with one person’s experience, of course.
As far as the form of abuse, one must look at the sign and the quadriplicity( cardinal, fixed or mutable) One must look at the chart to see how the abuse will play out but I think that abuse will occur in your situation with Nessus conjunct Dejanira. As such, I would be careful and watchful. If you do this, Astrology will serve it’s purpose, which is to warn and alert people to possible problems and even dangers. How fortunate we are to have such a wonderful body of info to help us!
Thank you, Amiann. That`s very interesting information. There is so few information on these aspects so I really appreciate reading more about it here and in the forum. The nessus and deja conjunction is in Cancer.
Thank you Ariel! Is this a synastry, Ariel? Who is whom?
Oops, sorry Amiann. I should have replied to the previous post, as it was a continuation of the conversation we had started. I was wondering how abuse would play itself out if the Nessus-Deja synastry conjunction is in Cancer.
No worries. I reply to the comments out of order because I do it on the central comment form. Ok–I really can’t comment on the sign, per se. It may be the abuse takes place in the home or within the family. I really have not looked at these aspects in signs, though. I suppose I should add that. I have looked at them unto themselves but everything matters so I will start to incorporate signs and houses. Thanks for the push in this direction, my Friend.
what do you think about a double-wammy moon sextile pluto and pluto square moon in sinastry?
This would be once in a lifetime kind of intense and tender. Lovely and very filled with passion!
This would be once in a lifetime kind of intense and tender. Lovely and very filled with passion!
ami, what would nessus trine dejanira in synastry indicate.
Welcome Dean!
These parts of you would flow well i.e may not play out in actual asbuse but would still be issues you both would deal with i.e abuse/victimhood imo I have not seen the trine in actual charts, dean.
Hi,
I have Dejanira in Pisces in the 4H. I was sexually abused in my home by a family member. I just found out my abuser’s Moon is 1 degree conjunct my Dejanira. Wow. Thank you for this information! The puzzle pieces are coming together for me…….. finally.
I also found out that my Nessus is 1 degree conjunct my current boyfriend’s Sun(Cancer). I am worried about being the abuser here. Do you have any advice for me?
Also, I discovered that my daughter has Dejanira conjunct her 2H Virgo Moon(3 deg. orb). Oh dear, I am soooooo freaked out!!!!!!! Is there anything I can do to help her?
Thank You so much for this info. on Dejanira and Nessus. It is really rocking my world right now <3
You made my day, Juice and Welcome! I will come back and answer when I have time to really look at the details.
About YOU being the Nessus with your b/f.
I think you will have the urge to abuse. I suppose you have choice on whether to act on it. That would seem to be the case but sometimes, the strength of these aspects get the better of us, so it is hard for me to answer.
For your daughter, watch out she does not get sexually abused. Keep an eye on anyone who is near her. 3 degrees is wide but this is one of the hardest aspects in the whole chart, so please be vigilant, as I know you will be!
Thank you for your response, I appreciate it very much.
Next, I have uncovered that in my Draconic Dejanira is 1 degree conjunct my natal Scorpio Moon. It seems like sexual abuse is an emotional “theme” that I am working with in this life. I am prone to being attacked in this way. I often am able to get away in time, and at other times I can get away only to a certain degree.
Knowing more……. I feel like it helps me. I have more compassion for myself, and I feel validated some ~ not to identify more as a victim……. it’s more like the astrology helps me to fill in the pictures. As I see more pieces, I think my awareness shifts, and I do feel like that makes a difference.
I don’t do the Draconic. I just never have, not that it is not good. What conjuncts your Aura? tell me your story, if you care to, Juice dear.
Hi, anyone can tell me more about a double whammy Pluto-Venus?
Pluto trine Venus, Venus quincunx Pluto …
🙂
thanks, M
Super passion unlike few else. I would put Moon/Pluto first in terms of super connection and passion and Venus/Pluto second.
I know this is an article for synastry, but I’m a little worried about my natal chart after reading about Nessus and Dejanira. Nessus conjuncts BML, and Dejanira conjuncts DSC and Pluto. Do you know what these aspects could mean? I’m trying really, really hard not to jump to conclusions, so any help or advice you could give would be very much appreciated.
Welcome, Britt. Wow, Pluto conj the DSC may be looking for partners who have strong primal power and you may not have accessed your own. Deja conj the DSC may make you look for wounded bird types. What do you think?
Thank you, amiann. And thank you for this article, I should have said that before. I do keep finding myself attracted to people who seem to have a strong primal power under the surface, and I don’t really feel connected to Pluto myself (I don’t know if that’s on purpose or simply because it’s otherwise weakly aspected in my chart). It took me a minute to think about the “wounded bird types”, but I think you might be right. I don’t mean to, but I think I find issues/hurts of my friends and partners and end up trying to mother them… if that’s what you meant.
Do you think I need to worry about the Nessus/BML conjunction or about abusing the poor wounded birds I keep looking for? For more context, Nessus/BML don’t aspect anything else except a grand trine with Mercury/MC and Jupiter. I don’t want to assume that having Nessus conj BML means I’m going to be abusive in sexual relationships.
You are so welcome, Britt and thanks so much for telling me that you like it. It makes my day 😀
What conjuncts the DSC, we disown and find in the partner. That is the nature of the DSC. About Nessus/BML, I would watch it. I think most people of the same time period would have it though, so it is not that big of a deal, I think. Can you relate to it or are just worried in general lol
Thanks! I’ve never seen the Descendant explained so clearly or succinctly before. That Pluto/DSC has been a source of confusion and frustration for me for a while, but now it makes sense.
I can’t really relate to Nessus at all, though I sometimes think I can feel BML itching under my skin. I guess I was just worried in general, just in case :P.
how about deja conjuct saturn 1 degree. what would result from this?
To me, you may really struggle with falling into the victim role and would have to keep pulling yourself up over and over until you get real traction which could take some time
oh im sorry. I meant in synastry her saturn conjuct his deja 1 degree
That’s ok. Aww She may ride his case for being a victim like say, “get over it” etc etc
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Thank you very much!
My ex has Scorpio Pluto conjunct my scorpio moon, and I have Sagittarius pluto conjunct his sagittarius moon. Amazing emotional+sexual chemistry though there was some bumps in the way. Our mars are square (aquarius:leo) also. It may seem challenging but we share many conjunctions and trines/sextiles.
I still talk to him to this day and I honestly will never forget how magnetic this relationship was.
Thanks Jen and Welcome!